Large Number of Projects - How to proceed?

10-19 Concepts 13 Multiple projects
1

Hello

I am new here and new to the JD System. I stumbled across it when researching NotePlan as a candidate for Note Taking. I am (was?) using AmpleNote but I am very interested in NotePlan. Furthermore, I have NotePlan to thank for steering me towards the JD System.

I am truly intrigued by this system and I am very pleased (and grateful) to have found my way here. Finally, a system that helps to organise notes/projects/areas etc!!!

I always felt a bit “uneasy” when it came to simply shoving tonnes of notes and data into a “system” (well, not really a system) and always wondering if the search engine of the tool being used was going to be able to retrieve what I needed, when I needed it (without having to then sift through potentially hundreds of search results).

Although I can see the huge potential of a system like this, the one area where I might become unstuck is with Projects. I handle a considerable number of Projects (mainly business Projects) and this is likely to result in me running out of available “numbers” in a matter of maybe 12 months or so.

Furthermore, some of my clients are “return” customers and some are likely to be “one offs”, so I am not sure if a “suffix/append” approach will work?

With that in mind, should I maybe start with additional decimal points to extend my Project number count?

Thank you for your time and allowing me to join the Forum.

2

G’day! And welcome.

‘Project’ means so many different things to different people – can you go a level deeper here, paint us a bit more of a picture? As much as you’re comfortable.

What are these projects, how big are they, how long do they last, how similar are they to each other, that sort of stuff.

3

Hello John

Thanks so much for the response.

My apologies for the lack of context/details. I should have expanded further.

Basically I run an Electronics Integration/Repair Company. I have a small team that work on all manner of Projects from small to very large Projects. We do a large number of Projects/Jobs each year. Some are repair work, some are installations (big and small), and some are quotes for potential repair work and/or installations (also big and small).

I have “Project/Job Management” software that handles the scheduling, logistics and the invoicing side of the Project/Job in question. The software does allocate a Job Number or Quote Number, depending on the nature of the enquiry. The same software absolutely sucks when it comes to task management and notes/knowledge management.

I have started using Linear for the Project/Task Management side of things (and Linear allocates a “ticket” number to all “issues” (tasks)). I also capture smaller/one off tasks in ToDoist and bring those issues together into Akiflow (a Planner/Diary System).

I use these two for general reliably (both on and off line) and to some degree, their simplicity. I have (in the past) tried MANY PM Platforms but found most of them either over complicated (and therefore overwhelming) or not able to meet my needs (including the occasional offline use as I travel into some areas with a lack of decent signal)

So that leaves the note/knowledge management side of things. For a while now I have been using AmpleNote and it is quite good. I don’t doubt that if I was to implement the JD System into AmpleNote, it would probably handle the structure without issue, but, they tend to encourage an alpha based tag/nested tag system to organise notes (which could probably be switched out for JD). For example, a nested tag (which they heavily encourage) might look like:

service/project/active/client x/project name

The problem I tend to have with that arrangement is that it’s too long and slightly cumbersome to implement on every Project. Additionally, the other issue I have is if I end up with multiple Projects for the same client (either consecutively or concurrently), I have to make sure the Project Name is very unique, or otherwise the system will fail to work.

Furthermore, when searching for material, the criteria has to be very precise or otherwise you end up with MANY search results. Also, beyond the “project name” there isn’t any further organisation.

I don’t doubt that one could change that same system to better suit JD. I am however looking at using a different note taking software (NotePlan) as it has a number of very attractive features that I would like to use.

Anyway, does that give you a better idea of my use case? I have been watching a number of your YouTube Videos and noticed that to expand on JD it might be feasible to have a mix of numbers and letters.

I also noticed (on the forum) a mention of a Business Pack/Course. Is that available as yet? Do you know what that might cost? Is it somewhat adaptable to my sort of business? Does it tend to cover scenarios such as when one ends ups with MANY projects each year?

I am really pleased that I stumbled onto your JD System as for MANY years now I have felt that my information was totally disorganised, fractured and frankly a scattered mess. I used to have nested folders on my computer, but, as software has changed and files tend to end up in various locations, I am not sure that using purely nested folders is the way to go (without at least also having a numbered (JD) system.

I have always felt a bit uneasy about the fact that all of my knowledge was simply captured and shoved into whatever was the most appropriate instrument (at the time). Without wanting to sound cliché, I want a SSOT (Single Source of Truth).

Now, when it comes to finding something, the process isn’t an easy task and often results in one almost giving up due to the complexity of locating information. Thank God you came up with a very clever way of systemising the process.

Thank you for your time.

4

So I’ll just talk out loud, as it were, and see where this goes. Interesting problem!

First, I think we can probably separate your business in to the stuff that isn’t a ‘client project’, and the stuff that is. The stuff that isn’t is all your standard business stuff and we’ll assume that’s not so much of a problem.

So our problem space is ‘client projects’. What’s interesting is that you already have an identifier for them: it’s the job number from your job management software. It probably makes sense to use that identifier as the master reference back to the job.

I think, then, your first job is to identify a common template that you can assign to each job. In situations like this I like a pattern where you start your template folders with a number from 10-90, like:

10 Customer information
20 Problem description
30 Root cause analysis
40 Parts ordered
50 Repair notes
60 Client invoice

…or similar. This will depend on exactly what information it is that you keep/need. Doing it in tens a) restricts you to 9 things so you don’t get carried away while b) leaving a bit of room between folders for stuff that you forgot and need to squeeze in later.

Because the trick here is consistency: every project needs to look the same. Then you can copy/paste folders for each new job, and people will learn where things will be.

So in JD world what I’d do would be to pick an area that’s going to house this stuff, and the whole thing would look like this:

x0-x9 Client projects
├── JOB35559 Alice's airconditioner
├── JOB35560 Bob's blender
├── JOB35561 Charlie's computer
│   ├── 10 Customer information
│   ├── 20 Problem description
│   ├── 30 Root cause analysis
│   ├── 40 Parts ordered
│   ├── 50 Repair notes
│   └── 60 Client invoice
├── JOB35562 Debbie's Dyson
│   ├── 10 Customer information
│   ├── 20 Problem description
│   ├── 30 Root cause analysis
│   ├── 40 Parts ordered
│   ├── 50 Repair notes
│   └── 60 Client invoice
└── JOB35563 Eddie's electric fryer
    └── ...and so on

The same should be applicable to your notes. Whichever app you land on, I’d suggest creating a note starting with the job ID for each new job, and pasting in a template. This should match the folder structure you decide on. So that’d just be blank headers for each of the items as above.

Unless you keep heaps of notes per job, I’d say try to have one job, one note. With headers within to keep it organised. That’s just going to make life much simpler. If that won’t suit, let me know and there’s another pattern you can use.

Decimal.Business is the mini-site for that. It’s not out yet, we’re still building it. It focuses more on the overall business side of things, at least initially.

But what you’ve described here is absolutely a pattern that others will recognise, so over time we’ll build out more comprehensive documentation and downloadable patterns. In a year or so I’d love to be able to answer a question like this with ‘just use pattern ABC1 from the business pack…’, but we’re not there yet.

I’ve massively simplified there, so let me know how that feels when compared to the real world. Very happy to keep working through it with you here, let me know which parts need more work.

1 Like
5

Hello John

OK thanks so much for the very fast and comprehensive reply.

I can certainly see the sense in your overall suggestion/s.

My Job/Project software links with Google Calendar and indeed transfers a fair bit of information onto this Calendar and G-Cal labels it as an “event”.

AmpleNote also links to the same G-Cal and I can create a “Meeting Note” for these “events”. I am hoping that NotePlan can do the same thing (according to the demos it can).

When I click on it in AmpleNote, a new note is created and looks like:

Job No. 1694 for surname, first_name

I am not sure if the format would be the same from NotePlan. I will have to investigate.

I like the idea of embedding the template in the Note for the Project (I believe both AmpleNote and NotePlan can do this). So I guess that’s a big tick.

I am just not sure if I then need to somehow change the above format so that it works in better with the JD System? I think I can change it to a different format and it will still reference back to the calendar event.

What do you think?

Do I shorten it to:

JOB1964_Surname_First Name

Or something like that?

How does that work in with the rest of a JD System? Should there possibly be a Prefix? For example:

30-39 Projects. So:

30.01-JOB1964_Surname_First Name

Or will that still ultimately result in me running out of index numbers?

Is it therefore valid to use:

30.01-JOB1964_Surname_First Name
30.01-JOB1965_Surname_First Name
30.01-JOB1966_Surname_First Name
30.01-JOB1967_Surname_First Name

Or is that essentially breaking the rules??? If so, do I add more decimal places to the 30.xx ? Eg: 30.0001 ???

Thanks for the feedback on the Decimal.Business. I will keep an eye out for that aspect of your system.

Thanks again for your valued feedback and time. I am very grateful.

6

In this situation I’d abandon the JD ID once you’re inside that area. It serves no purpose, adds no value, and an external system has already generated an ID for you. Just use that ID.

(I assume your job codes increment sequentially? So that folder will just be a neat, chronologically ordered lists of jobs?)

This is a variant of the ‘expand an area’ idea; there’s more on that here 13.21 Expand an area • Johnny.Decimal.

7

OK thanks for the reply (again) John.

I really appreciate your feedback and insights.

Correct, my system automatically and sequentially increments the Job Number.

The same thing happens with Quotes (which are essentially Projects too, in their own right), and, because they could essentially have the same number (as they both increment in separate sections of the software), I will end up with something like:

JOB1964
QUOTE1964

or

J1964
Q1964

Probably the latter is a better option as it is more compact. Do you think I also need the Client (or Business) Name?

Thanks again for you valued input.

8

I assume a Quote eventually (hopefully!) turns in to a Job? If so, I’d probably give each of them a JD category, but then when you ‘win’ a job, move the Quote inside the Job.

If the quote itself might be complex – you have to really take a thing apart and do the root cause analysis and get the cost of some parts – then you might just use the same standard 10-60 subfolders for the quote, even though some of them will be blank at this stage. Then you can just move the whole lot over when the job is won: Quote just becomes Job?

So your file structure would look something like (assuming we use 30-39 – pick whatever area number you want):

30-39 Quotes and Projects
├── 31 Quotes
│   ├── Q1964 Alice's aircon
│   └── Q1967 Charlie's computer
└── 32 Projects
    ├── P1965 Bob's blender
    │   ├── 10 Original quote
    │   ├── 20 Problem description
    │   ├── 30 Root cause analysis
    │   ├── 40 Parts ordered
    │   ├── 50 Repair notes
    │   └── 60 Client invoice
    └── P1966...
        └── ...etc.

Might as well keep that quote close to the job that it relates to. Assuming that’s a 1:1 relationship?

If that would be less convenient for any reason – maybe another member of staff looks after quotes and would wonder where it went – then just leave them in 31. But otherwise I like the idea of the project folder containing everything to do with that job. You never have to look anywhere else.

I’d put something there, even if it’s just a short version. In 6 months you might not remember what it meant, in which case use the job code to refer back to the system. But in the short term it’ll help you as you navigate projects day-to-day.

Appreciate the appreciation. As always, a pleasure.

9

Hi @Darb and welcome here.
Is it all kind of making sense? Reading the thread so far, I thought I’d add my take/summary, for future readers as much as for you.

You use JD ID’s when things don’t have a clear location/name and you need to create that clarity. In the example: deciding to create categories 31 and 32 for Quotes and Projects is a perfect use for JD IDs: you have now identified very clearly where to look for information on Quotes and Projects. Otherwise, they might get mixed up on your hard drive with all kinds of other admin :wink:

Your Jobs already have a unique identifier. Combined with the fact that you’ll obviously go over 100, it makes sense to use those identifiers. And this is an officially sanctioned case where it’s ok to break the rule of 100 IDs in a category.

What both provide is a unique string of text you can search for/filter by. That should work in any software. One trick is to add a bit of extra formatting to aid your search. In your case, the fact that the ID is immediately preceded by JOB or QUOTE does this for you: this filters out any occurences of, say, the year 1967. Otherwise, for example if Surname, First Name was the only way you had of identifying things, you could wrap that in brackets to give your search tool something to separate what you’re looking for from other instances of that string of text: [Surname, First Name].

The crucial final step is that your Index records how you use work with your system. You don’t list every Job in the index; but in your note for the category you record:

  • which locations information can be found (filesystem, GCal, AmpleNote…)
  • what the IDs look like (what to search for to find a particular Job)
  • your workflow for adding/migrating/completing Jobs
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10

Thank you John!!!

Again, I really appreciate the advice.

11

Thank you @hans

I appreciate your input and advice on this subject. I think you and @johnnydecimal are thinking very much along the same lines.

This certainly makes sense to me and I am looking forward to implement such a system.

Thanks again (to both of you).

12

@ Darb -

I’m late to this, but here’s how I’ve dealt with a similar problem. First, we have one list of consecutive project numbers for all leads that get far enough that we send out a proposal. If it becomes a job, the folder is already there; if it doesn’t, we wasted a number. It turns out that wasting some numbers in a consecutive sequence literally does not matter. This system saves us having to move anything from (your example) Q to J.

Every project gets an identical folder as below. If the project manager needs to modify it, they can, but it rarely happens.

Don

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